Alice Young

Alice Young

transcription

interview

Alice Young

Val Wang

2004-07-01

English

middle school principal

Q: We’re at PS 131 with Alice Young. So, can you first introduce yourself and say your name and---say your name.

Young: Okay. My name is Alice Young.

Q: And, can you talk a little bit about where you were born and where you grew up, where you spent your first few years?

Young: Sure. Well, actually, I was born in Manhattan because, that was, in Manhattan there was only, the only Chinese obstetrician-gynecologist, so I was born on 15^th Street, but we lived in Brooklyn, and I grew up in Brooklyn, I lived in Brooklyn all my life. And I went to school there, elementary school, all the way through college. I just stayed---I’m really a Brooklyn girl. (laughs)

Q: So where in Brooklyn were you?

Young: Actually, I grew up in a neighborhood called Gravesend, and my father owned a laundry that picked up laundry from all the Chinese hand laundries, so he had a factory where they pressed and ironed and folded shirts, and he had a 24-hour crew that worked, and we lived, you know, some of my friends who lived behind the hand laundry, we lived on top of the laundry, with all the machines running, all the presses and a lot of noise. So that’s where I grew up, until I got married.

Q: And what was that neighborhood like?

Young: Well, it’s called Gravesend, and it’s an Italian neighborhood. Actually, I lived on MacDonald Avenue, and that was where the F train runs, and so it was an elevated train with a lot of noise. And I remember when I was in college someone had asked me for my phone number and I gave the number to someone, and when he called me, he thought I gave him like a phony number that was in a subway station. (laughs)

So I lived there until I was twenty-three.

Q: Okay, so do you know much about your parents’ past and how they came to the States?

Young: Yeah, sure, I know a lot. Actually, when, my father came to this country when he was thirteen with his uncle and with his father, and at that time they let only men come to this country, and my father’s uncle, which I guess his father’s brother owned a laundry up in Scarsdale, so they settled there for a little bit, and then they, because they just lacked the connection to Chinese people, they decided to come to New York City, to Chinatown, and so in Chinatown there was, there’s always an apartment or an association, so there was a young apartment for all people with a young family. So he came and he lived there, and it was right on Bayard Street.

And then my grandfather opened up a laundry in Brooklyn on King’s Highway. And I think my father always told us that he liked to be away from the Chinese people, so he always just to move out of Chinatown. So that’s why we always stayed in Brooklyn and we just never lived there. So they opened up a laundry there---he said he was about fifteen. And that’s where they stayed, and my grandfather, you know, the whole concept was they come here, they make money and they save money, and they send money back to China, and then one day they would go back to China.

So, my grandfather got sick here, and he wanted to go back home, because that’s where his homeland was, so he went back, and then my father and my uncle stayed here, and it was funny because then my father approached the age of, I guess, eighteen, and they told him he had to go back and get married. So then he went back, and he got married, and like, my oldest brother was born, and then he left them there, and his---came back here, he worked, and about, like, maybe eight years later he went back to China, and that’s when my next brother was born. (laughs)

So every time he went back and forth, he had a child. And then in 1949, when the communists came, were starting to come into China and go into Nanking, which is the southern capital, he decided, he went to see a lawyer and he decided that he would bring his family, my brothers and my mom to America. And that, the idea of saving money and living in China forever, it just---that was the end of it. So he knew that everyone should come here, ‘cause he just didn’t want to be in China anymore. So that’s how, that’s why, that’s when they came here.

Q: Okay. Was it hard for them to come over at that point? In terms of passports, and---

Young: Yeah, well, you know, he had to get, well, actually, you know, because he had a laundry in a very kind of, I guess it was a well-to-do area, and so it was doctors and lawyers were his customers, and he had a lawyer who brought shirts into him regularly, and he started asking him, you know, “How do I bring my family here, I have family---“ so he took all his papers, and, you know, gave it to the lawyer and he did what he needed to do. So in 1949 my father went back to China, and then he just started all the paperwork to bring his family here. And so the joke in my family is, because I was born in 1950, was that I was made in Hong Kong, because when my mother came here in May of 1950, she was pregnant, and it was with me, so I was like the first child, you know, their child born here.

Q: So how many of, total children were there?

Young: There are five of us. I have three brothers, and they’re older than I am, and they were all born in, two in China, one in Hong Kong. And then when we came here, when they came here, I was born. And then I have a younger sister.

Q: And so you all five grew up in then, in Gravesend? In Brooklyn?

Young: Yeah, in Brooklyn, but don’t forget there was such a big age span between my oldest brother, I mean, he could probably be my, almost my father. So he was, when he came here he was already married.

Q: Okay, so he came with his wife?

Young: Well, they came first without his wife, and then the immigration laws were such that he came first, and then he applied for his wife to come here, but they were already married in China.

Q: Okay, so at that point, so what was it like growing up in the fifties? You said it was a very Italian neighborhood?

Young: Yeah, it was a very Italian neighborhood. My sister and I were the only Chinese family, Chinese children in the entire school. It was, I don’t know, I don’t remember much of my elementary school years. It’s such a---my parents were very strict, and, you know, I always had to take care of my sister, who’s just thirteen months younger than I am. And the mentality was like, you don’t need any friends, and you don’t go anywhere after school, and you just come back home and you do your homework, and you do, you know---so it was just a lot of going to school, coming home, going to school, coming home. And then, my father was, I mean, I don’t know. Now I can understand why he did what he did, but we didn’t have a TV at home. He insisted that we speak Chinese at home, and no English, and there wasn’t any, there wasn’t games, we always did homework, we wrote, and then he had the laundry, so after we finished our homework we had to go downstairs and help him in the laundry.

So his, I guess his philosophy was that he always, my mother used to say, “Well, how are they ever going to learn English, and they don’t know anything.” And so he says, “Don’t be afraid that we don’t learn English.” He was just so afraid that we would lose the Chinese, and the culture and everything, so, you know, he just kept, at home, everything was Chinese, and we weren’t allowed to speak English at all. And I remember getting, in the third grade we really bugged my parents, and finally he said we could have a TV. So I remember one day, I was in the third grade, and he came and picked us up after school, he drove us to Sears, and we bought, like, our first television. And then when it was delivered, I still remember it was on a Friday afternoon, and we just, like, we had a living room, but it wasn’t you know, we had a couch and a table. And so we had a spot for the TV, and we took two, like, I don’t know, folding chairs. And my sister and I just sat there, and they delivered the TV, we plugged it in, and it was on Channel 7, and American Bandstand was on, and I really didn’t even know what it, how that TV functioned, so we just turned it on. And I didn’t even know that we could change it to different channels and stuff, so every day we sat and we watched American Bandstand, and I would go to school and tell my friends that you know, I have a TV, and they would say, “Oh good, did you see this and that?” and you know, all these shows, and I said, “What are you talking about?” So then we decided to play around with the knobs and we discovered that, you know, we could change it and watch something else. And when I think back, I say, “Boy, we were really sheltered..”

Q: You didn’t have any friends?

Young: Not really. I mean, you know, my parents didn’t let us go to each others’ homes, and certainly they didn’t let anyone come into our house, and they were always working downstairs and we were upstairs, and we would watch TV or read or, you know, fight. (laughs) My sister and I. And there were times, like, even at school, when we had to do, I remember we had to do committee reports, and plus we, after school, where we have to come together and do a research project. And I had to really, really convince my father that it was legit, you know, that we were---

And then he would drive us to their homes and pick us up, and we did do that, you know.

Q: For school.

Young: For school. Yeah.

Q: So what dialect of Chinese do you speak?

Young: We speak Cantonese.

Q: Okay. And where was your family from?

Young: Well, they’re from, at that time we call it Canton, but now it’s Guangzhou. And it’s a southern province, and I guess, provincial, the province would be Hoksan. So we spoke Hoksanese, I guess, you know.

And every Sunday we went to Chinese school, so that was a real ritual.

Q: Where was that?

Young: In Chinatown. And, you know, it’s not like today where you could get groceries and things like that, and Chinese vegetables in Brooklyn, so every Sunday was a trip we, like, ate lunch, after lunch we came out, we had a one o’clock class, Chinese school from one o’clock to three, and then my parents picked us up, and there was an arcade, he would give us a quarter. In those days, a quarter took us a long way. So we went to the arcades, and then my mother loved the Chinese opera, you know, the Chinese movies. So we would go to that, and then we’d eat dinner, and then we’d get home like around eight o’clock. So that was like, our Sunday.

Q: Every Sunday growing up.

Young: Every Sunday, yeah, until we, I guess until we got into Junior High School, we would do that, ‘cause that’s when I stopped going to Chinese school.

Q: So did you have much contact with the Chinese community other than----

Young: No, not really. You know, just with our families, and we didn’t do much in Chinatown, except go see movies and go to Chinese school, and that was it. And eat dinner.

Q: Did you have extended family here? You said your dad’s uncle was here. Did they have family also here?

Young: Well, actually yeah, well, they all went back to China and they passed away, but my father had his brother here, so it was my uncle and my aunt, and cousins, and it was quite a, you know, extended family, but I think smaller based on other people’s families.

Q: Did you see them a lot?

Young: We would see each other on Sundays, when we’d go to Chinatown, there was a, 22 Mott Street was a grocery store, and our whole family, most of us did live in Brooklyn, but that’s where we would do our shopping, and you know, my father would drive, and he’d pick up like tons of groceries, because the laundry that he ran, there were eight hour shifts, and most Chinese establishments always serve lunch and dinner, so my mother cooked for like, fifty people, and made lunch, and made dinner, and then the next shift comes, would come in, and then they’d hire someone who would cook, like, make a meal, around, like, two in the morning that was served. So she was like constantly cooking these huge meals and it was like about fifty people eating with us, in the laundry.

Q: So, how big was the laundry?

Young: It was huge. It was huge. It was like, maybe, it was bigger than this entire library. Because there were presses, five pressing machines, and then there was about thirteen ironing, fourteen ironing tables, and men would iron and fold, and we would box up all the shirts and then send it out to the laundry, the local laundries.

Q: So where were these workers all from?

Young: Mostly from Chinatown. And they would take the train, the subway. They worked very long hours, I mean, the shift was from eight o’clock to eight o’clock. And then the night shift was from eight in the evening until eight the next morning. And most of the times it was six days a week, you know. We worked hard.

Q: You said your dad sort of wanted to stay apart from Chinatown. Did he ever tell you why?

Young: Well, I think he wanted us to just grow up away from, I don’t know, he just felt that he didn’t want us to be under the influence of, I don’t know, there weren’t many gangs like there were in the ‘70s and ‘80s, but he just felt, I don’t know why, he said, he used to say this funny expression. He says when the Chinese people move into the neighborhood, it’s time to move out. (laughs) I don’t know why. He just, I don’t know, he just felt that he wanted us, although we spoke English at home, he wanted us to grow up in a more residential, not like a place filled with, you know, restaurants and small apartments. We had an apartment that was pretty spread out, and we each had a room, so it was nice.

Q: So, I guess, fast-forwarding up till you went to college.

Young: Yeah, I went to college. I went to college at Brooklyn College, and you know, my father would deliver shirts to all these laundries, and he always, always, wherever he went, I don’t know what it was, but he would always drive by Brooklyn College, this huge campus with the clock and the steeple, and he would say to me, and my sister, and he would say, “You know, this is where you’re going to go to college. This is a college.” And it just, in the quadrangle, I could see it, down Bedford Avenue into the College. And so somehow whenever he would deliver his shirts he wound up on Bedford Avenue by Brooklyn College. And I guess it was like so ingrained in us, that when we, when I applied to go to college, I actually didn’t apply to many colleges. And he would never let us go away. And we didn’t even think about it.

So I went to college. Went to Brooklyn College. And then, when I began to drive and I learned how to drive, I said, “Now, how did he get here?” Like, I didn’t even know. It looked so pretty. It didn’t look like it was in the middle of Brooklyn. So, and I went with my sister, so of course my sister went to Brooklyn College also. So it was kind of like, the expectation is we would go to college, and I guess I was lucky to have a father who would allow us to go to college, ‘cause a lot of my friends in high school---and as I got older I kind of developed friends with, you know, some of my friends became, or they were customers of my fathers. So I started having, like, a circle of Chinese friends, basically from the laundries that I would go with my father to collect shirts. And they were our age, and we somehow or other got together. And a lot of the girls didn’t go to college, because the parents felt that they were saving money for their sons, or that girls just shouldn’t go to college. So from my high school friends who were Chinese, I think my sister and I were one of the few kids who went to college.

Q: Why do you think your dad was different in that way?

Young: Because he really believed in education. He really said that you have to go to school and you have to go to college, whether you were a boy or a girl. And I think he always instilled in us that we should do well in school, and that every generation should do better, and that no one should be working like a horse or a cow like he did for fifteen hours a day. So we just always, just always, like did well, and we did the best we could. But his whole, the way he brought us up was that we had to go to school, this is America, this is why we’re here. You know, and we did, we did, we worked hard, and it was like, difficult, because they couldn’t help us, and they didn’t speak much English, and I remember we had to do a report, and we needed an encyclopedia, and he wouldn’t let us go to the library, right? And he had no idea---I couldn’t even explain to him what an encyclopedia was. I just told him it was a book, we need this, we need these books, we have to get to the library. And so his thing was, “I’ll buy it for it. So, where do we go?” So we went into a bookstore, and we asked them for, we asked the guy in the bookstore for a set of encyclopedia, he looked at us like, “You’re nuts. You can’t buy it here.” So this one customer walked in, and he goes, “You know what, I have a whole set of the Book of Knowledge, but I’m missing ‘L.’ Do you want to buy it?” So my father bought it for us. And they were like, torn apart, and the threads were hanging out of the spine. So he did buy it for us, so we used that, the Book of Knowledge.

And then, the lawyer who helped bring my whole family over, he did a lot, he wrote checks for my father. He did all the bills. So every Saturday we would go to see him and bring pastries and bring cakes and bring all the newspapers, and my father paid for it. Just gave it to him, like it was a Saturday ritual. And we would get his laundry, and then do his laundry, bring it back all pressed and folded and everything. And so we asked him, and he goes, “Oh, you want, is that what you want?” And I said, “Yes.” So then my father spent like three hundred dollars. In those days, it was a lot of money. And he bought the whole World Book Encyclopedia, with the bookshelf, with everything single year we additioned that, you know? So I think when we were in the fifth grade, we had our own set of encyclopedia.

So, he tried to get us everything we wanted. It was hard, because he didn’t know any English. I remember I needed a stapler. And I really didn’t know, like, where to get it. So he drove from Brooklyn all the way to Chinatown to Waku bookstore on Mott Street. And we got this Swingline stapler. I still have it. You know, so, it was kind of interesting, growing up. Frustrating.

Q: Yeah?

Young: Yeah.

Q: So by the, so you had some friends, then, starting in high school.

Young: Yeah, we had some friends starting in high school, then when we went into college, you know, we kind of went our own way, a lot of the girls didn’t want to go to college, and then in college, I developed this circle of friends, but basically they were Chinese. I joined the Chinese club. And then the year after that, my sister came. So we did, and then we kind of just hung out, and it was a lot---in fact, I still have friends I went to college with, and we’ve just stayed close.

Q: So were most of your friends there of a similar background to you?

Young: Yeah, yeah, pretty much. And their families basically owned laundries, and growing up the same way, and being first born in the United States, pretty much.

Q: Were there a lot of people like that at Brooklyn College at that time?

Young: Yeah, basically, yeah.

Q: So when you were in college, what did you major in?

Young: I majored in education. I always knew I wanted to teach. I had a nephew who, he is my brother’s son. He had problems and, you know, they separated when my nephew was about maybe two years old, and he lived in our house and he stayed with us. And I just enjoyed taking care of him. And I would take him, I think I was in high school, and I would take him to school, drop him off or pick him up on my way to class. Maybe the first year of college. And it’s funny, like I would see his teachers, and like, young teachers, and they looked so nice and they’d have their cars and everything, and I just liked taking care of him. So I wanted to teach, I always wanted to, so I just majored in education, and then I went through the four years, and did my student teaching, and I enjoyed it. I always---and then, after I graduated, I graduated in ’71, and at that time, there was a surplus of teachers. So I got a job working in a daycare center, with three and a half year olds. That wasn’t so much fun. They slept, they had accidents, they woke up, they cried.

So I did that for like, half a year. And then I substituted, in, it was a District 1 school, and then, in, I started teaching in ’72, and then, I’ve been in school since then.

Q: So did you live with your parents all the way through college?

Young: Yeah, we stayed home, I lived with my parents, I got married in 1973, and that’s when I moved out. A real exciting life. (laughs) Really exciting.

Q: So, who did you get married to?

Young: My husband, David, he’s actually, I don’t know, I guess he’s imported. He grew up in Rochester, and his, I went to college with his cousin, and that’s how I met him, when he came to New York City he was living---he is a teacher also, and he came to New York City and he was looking for a teaching job. And then I met him through his cousin, who I went to college with, and so that---

Q: And where did you move?

Young: (laughs) Really far away. About three blocks away from where my parents lived. And so then we lived there for awhile, and then my parents sold the building where the laundry is, and my, my younger sister was living at home also, and then they, for the first time ever they rented an apartment, ‘cause my father always owned the building that we lived in. And he always promoted being in his own business and being his own boss, and owning the place that you live. So it was the first time ever that they rented an apartment and they paid rent. So they did that for three years with my sister.

Q: Was that in your neighborhood?

Young: No, they ventured out to like about maybe two miles away. And they did that for three years, and the rent started to go up and up and my father just couldn’t stand it, so my sister said, proposed the idea that we look for a house and we buy a house together. And I said, sure, that’s fine, you know. So she found this huge 16-room two family house, so we bought that, and that’s where we live now, and so she and my parents lived on the first---on the second floor, and David and I lived on the first floor.

Q: And where was that?

Young: And so, that’s in the, I guess the, Marine Park area. So it’s still in Brooklyn, and we still live there now, and I have two kids. My parents passed away, and my sister got married, and then she bought her own house, so now we kind of, I bought the house from her, I paid her for her share, so we own the house now.

Q: And you’ve been there since?

Young: Since 1978. I’m not a real mover. I don’t experiment, move out of my surroundings. But I enjoy living in Brooklyn. It’s kind of quiet, and, but the---it’s convenient. And, but, now, when I was teaching, I taught on the Lower East Side, and in the seventies, the city was really having financial difficulties, and then I was laid off, and then I ended up teaching on Staten Island, and then I taught in Brooklyn, and then I had my son, and I taught in Crown Heights. It was a really tough area. A lot of West Indian students, and it’s just a very poor area. You know, I had a good time, I had a lot of fun teaching there, but when I came back, after having my son, it was like, God, what a ---it was a struggle. You know, it’s a struggle, because kids are needy.

And in the evenings I always taught in Chinatown. I taught adults English, so I did that for like 15 years. So every day I was teaching in Brooklyn, and on Tuesdays and Thursdays, I would be out in Chinatown teaching English to adults from 7:30 to 10. And just being part of that Chinatown community with the adults, my Chinese got better, although I was teaching English, but I got a chance to use my Chinese and everything. And I thought about coming to Chinatown to teach, so that’s when I moved into, in 1985, I taught at PS 1, and I taught fifth and sixth grade there for eleven years, before I came here to be a principal.

Q: Okay. So were you always teaching elementary school?

Young: Yeah. I was an elementary, by license I’m an elementary school teacher. And I always taught fifth and sixth grade.

Q: And then, when did you come here?

Young: In 1996.

Q: Okay that was after PS 1.

Young: Yeah, it was after PS 1. When I taught at PS 1, my principal was really, I learned a lot from her, she was like my mentor, and she would say, “Why don’t you become a principal?” And she’s not Chinese, and she said that the community needs someone who is Chinese, you could be---she always believed in being role models and having role models for children, and she said that, “Why don’t you go to school, go back to school, get your license and be a principal and to say, you could be someone who could be a role model for children, to help the parents,” and that’s when I decided that, you know, that’s nice, because I see how Chinese parents come into the school, and just the fact that they have a teacher who is Chinese, they feel like they could speak to and, you know, can open up to and relate to, and just that initial meeting is so much conducive to, you know, speaking and opening, and where they don’t have that openness when someone is non-Asian, you know, it’s just that relaxing, kind of soothing effect.

So then I went to school in the evenings, and got a CCNY [City College of New York] grant that was funded by CCNY and the Department of Ed, and I went for one year and got my certification to be a principal. And then they were looking for someone---it was the year when elementary school got capped at grade six, and grade six was part of the middle school, so it was six, seven, eight. So the superintendent asked me to come here to be the assistant principal, and I was very nervous, because I never, I was never ever in a middle school. Ever. I never taught in one. And he just said, just do it, he wants the middle school to become like an elementary, closer to an elementary school model, where kids are nurtured, it’s not like a junior high school. So I came here in ’96 as an assistant principal, and then the principal was also new here, and they had a lot of issues, and so he asked me to become principal in April of that same year, school year. And then I was the principal here from ’97, April ’97 until June 2003.

Q: And, how did you find it different to be principal rather than teaching?

Young: It was, you know, I stepped out of the classroom into this huge place of 1400 children, 120 teachers, it was really, I learned by doing, you know? And I remember asking, other principals, asking my principal for help. I would call her every night with all these issues. But it was, you have to learn on your feet, and you have to think fast, and a lot of quick decisions, and I think what, you know, my principal told me was, “Always put the kids in front of you, and when you make your decision, always make sure the kids are in front of you, and it’s a decision that will be the best for the kids.” Because, you know, this school was a very traditional school, with very, I would say, not the best teaching practice, and so, in order to turn a school around to move a school, is going to upset a lot of the adults and a lot of the teachers. But every decision I made, I was able to say, you know, the rationale is, how would that make it better for the kids? And so it became a lot easier, and I think if you have a philosophy, or a goal, or just a picture of how you want the classrooms to look and how you want the kids to learn, it makes it that much easier.

But of course, a lot of lives were upset, a lot of changes in the school, no one likes change. But, you know, sometimes it has to happen.

Q: What’s a traditional school versus a (?) school.

Young: Okay, well, you know, traditional in teaching would be the way I went to school. You know, everybody staying in rows, the teacher is very frontal teaching, the teacher lectures, you read a story, answer the questions. There is kind of, very little conversation among the kids and the teachers, and the teacher is always there. The teacher is teaching. And I’m much more progressive in my thinking, and I think the teacher should be facilitating, the teacher should be helping kids learn how to ask questions, and when children ask the questions, then they should be, like, we can guide them and show them how to find the answers, and after that just to kind of gain that knowledge, so it’s not always from me, it’s not always that I know everything, where kids will ask questions and do their own research.

And I really believe in, you know, learning outside of the building, and going to museums and going to cultural institutions, having experts and speakers come in. So that would be a different kind of teaching. So with that belief and being the principal of this school, where kids were all in rows and lots of frontal teaching, and using one textbook, you know, it was hard, it was hard to make those changes, but you know, I think we have, and kids really enjoy learning now.

Q: And can you talk a little bit about this school, just the makeup of the students?

Young: Oh, well, sure. This school has about 87 or 88 percent of the children are Asian. 96 or 91, maybe I think it’s 96 percent of the kids are entitled to free lunch, so that means we’re a Title One school, and I guess it’s the poverty level, the threshold, so 91 percent of our kids qualify for that. But we have one of the highest attendance rates in this district. Ninety-seven percent attendance. Fifteen percent of our kids are African-American, Latino. And we have, ten percent of our kids are special education children. Over half of our children are English language learners, which means that they haven’t gained the English proficiency, they haven’t passed the English proficiency tests, so they just need that extra help and they are mandated to take ESL.

There’s a bilingual program, about 120 to 150 kids in each grade, so where they’re instructed in their native language in some content area. So most of the time we teach the social studies and the math in Chinese, and our children who are in the bilingual classes and get instructed in Chinese and math, out-perform our Gen Ed kids, because they come with such skills in math, but they’re just missing the English, so we basically teach them in Chinese, you know, math concepts in Chinese.

Q: So what kind of challenges does that, other kinds of challenges does that pose, just having a lot of kids who don’t speak English, or whose parents don’t speak English?

Young: Yeah, well, you know, the challenge is to get them to, to motivate them to learn English. We also, you know, teach native language arts, and we try, the hope is to gain the English but also maintain some kind of the Chinese reading a writing and listening and speaking, and to motivate them to not get discouraged because, you know, kids see that they’re so behind and it’s so hard to catch up, and so of course we don’t want them to drop out. And they’re at an age where they come and they’re in the eighth grade and they’re thirteen, fourteen years old,---you know, there’s a lot of distractions. So we want to make sure that we can motivate them to stay. So, that’s why we, you know, I brought in, like a full arts program. We really have wonderful teachers and this way that would maybe make them want to read and write and talk about the dance, about the art, or about theater.

You know, we have a chess club, we do photography, so we try to keep them going. We’re not always successful, but basically kids stay, they graduate, and hopefully they get into a good---a high school that fits their needs.

Q: How much contact do you have with their parents?

Young: Um, you know, it’s hard to get---that’s one of our struggles, is to get parents to really participate and involved in the school. I think it’s because it’s a very Western concept of coming to school and having a voice and being welcomed, and you know, especially with our parents in Chinatown, they work so much, and they just----and culturally, they feel that, you know, my children are at your school, you’re the experts, you’re the educational experts, and now I’m going to go to work and you do what you need to do. So they don’t even know that the Western concept is that we want parent engagement, we want parent involvement. So it is really very difficult to get parents to be here, even at PTA meetings, or fundraising, ‘cause our parents are very, you know, they’re poor, and they need to be at work all the time. But I know that this year the mayor put in a new position called “parent coordinator,” and they’re exclusively to promote parent engagement. And I know that this school has really doubled or tripled the number of parents who come to meetings, because the parent coordinator calls them up, lets them know, ‘please come to this meeting,’ so someone who, 100 percent of her time is to canvas parents, survey parents, find out what they need, and I think that was a very smart thing, one of the real positive things of this reform of Mayor Bloomberg’s, so that’s really good.

Q: Do you ever feel you could---when those parents come in to talk to you, they feel more comfortable---

Young: Yeah.

Q: ---Like there’s a way that, in which there is still some kind of gap, because you grew up here, and they’re----

Young: Yeah, of course there’s a gap, and then, I --- now that the population of this area, and we have a lot of Fujianese parents coming in. So most of the times I would say that I cannot communicate with them, because they speak Mandarin and they speak Fukanese, and I only speak Cantonese, so I find like this gap now, it’s, it’s bigger. But we depend on translation so much, and we depend on kids translating---I mean, sometimes for me to understand a child, we have to go through like three people before we get the message, and I’m sure some of it gets lost. So, it’s hard, but I think it’s just the warmth of the school, and now that the culture of the school is different, so I guess it makes it different, and of course with the parent coordinator piece, that you know, it really just makes it better.

Q: What other changes have you seen here?

Young: In the school?

Q: Yeah. Since ’96, till you left last year.

Young: Well, definitely the way children are learning, ‘cause I’m not a one-textbook person, so there are just---our rooms are filled with books on every level. I really believe that we have to find out where the child is and find out what the child likes and just make every effort to have those kind of books and have those things for the kids. You know, kids are learning together, there’s more inquiry-based, and kids are asking questions. And when I first came here, the school was quiet. You didn’t hear kids talk, because the teachers had them just in rows, and the teacher was always talking. But now, you know, the kids are happy, and the kids are talking to one another, and we do small book groups, and we do literature circles, and you know, kids are learning. And I bring in an awful diverse group of people to come in and work with them, especially in the arts. We always have, we have a good connection with MoCA, we have a connection with Elders Share the Arts, the Asian-American Arts Center, and so we have a lot of different collaboratives, and you know, LeRoy Street, across the street, the architects, if you look at our corner on Hester and Eldridge---so we did a two-year project with LeRoy Street Architects. Thirty children went across the street, they have a little storefront classroom, and their project was to change the corner plot, a little piece of land, into a place that will make the neighborhood, or make that little corner more appealing and appeasing to the public.

So they really did a great job, and they studied that space as an architect, so they studied the light in that area, the noise, the different kinds of noise, the amount of people who pass by, and they really looked at that little corner plot, and they came up with an idea of how do we make it a place where it’s appealing and nice and attractive. So they came up with this whole concept of wishing wells. And so they built little, they built wishing wells with mosaic tile. So if you look at the corner, I don’t know if you’ve seen it, but look at it, and then they did ceramic tiles, and put that up on the wall. And this was a two-year project, and then they did all these metal sculptures of like, wind chimers, so they’re all up, it’s just like, ten-feet high, and they did it. And last week we had an opening. So it was really nice. So that’s the kind of learning, that’s how kids should be learning. And it was hard because, when you have parents who are not used to that kind of instruction, kids who come from China and not learning that way. So we really had to go at it slowly. I remember in the beginning of the year, when I first came here and we had no textbooks, and we just had regular books, you know. So parents were really, got upset, and said, “God, there’s no books, where’s the textbooks, in Wagner Junior High School they have books.” And I said, “You know what?” and I tried to, with translators, and school board members came and supported me, and I said to them, you know, if you go to a bookstore and you want to learn about, you know, World War II, you’re never going to get a textbook that gives you three pages or two paragraphs about World War II, you would get a book that says, you know, Battles of World War II, or Presidents During World War II, and that’s the way your kids should learn, cause textbooks are just companies making money off schools.

So, slowly, you know, it started to change, and now parents don’t question it, they just know that that’s the way to learn. They used to not want to go on trips to museums and stuff, and they’d say to me, the parents would say, “Well, you know, they went there last year.” And even the way the trip in Chinese, is like, to play, or---so I said, “Well, that’s okay, we’re going, and this is what we’re doing, here’s the worksheet, this is what we’re going to look at, and your kids are learning earth science, and we’re going to the museum and they’re going to look at the rocks.”

And so they get it now, so I don’t have any more flack about leaving the building or going to visit somewhere. So that’s good.

Q: You sound like you do have a very progressive outlook. How did they develop, ‘cause it sounds like growing up you had a pretty traditional schooling.

Young: Yeah, and actually, I credit that to teaching in District Two. ‘Cause when I was a teacher here, Anthony Alvarado was the superintendent, and he really let teachers leave the classroom and learn from one another, visit each other’s teaching, and read. And so we read a lot of professional books, we talked a lot, we looked at different methods of teaching and how kids should be learning, and we did a lot of research, and I think that made me kind of look at what teaching was all about, and not just accept----‘cause when I was teaching in Brooklyn, you know, they hand you the books and those are the books you use, and there was never any conversation, I never went to a workshop, I never left the building. The principal never engaged us in reading a book and talking about, or about how we teach. We didn’t visit each other. But when I came to District Two, that’s what we did. And then I just realized that, you know, that’s why I say, kind of, my school years are like kind of a blur. It was just not exciting. I did it because I had to do it, and I knew my father would be pissed if I didn’t bring home good grades.

And I wasn’t allowed to go anywhere, so I might as well stay home and read. And then, you know, like, once I started teaching I really learned to be a better reader. I really was able to kind of question what I read, and talked about what I read, and it was really so hard for me when I would take a workshop and say well, you know, think about the book, reflect on it, think about your life, and it was hard for me to do that, because I was never allowed to ask questions or say what I felt or what I thought. So I had to learn to do that. And I think in that process of learning how to do that, I kind of looked at teaching in a different way, ‘cause that’s not how I learned. And I just, you know, I mean, I won’t know the answer, but I was wondering if I had learned that way, you know, where would I be, and what would I be thinking, you know? Yeah, so I didn’t know that, how it would pan out if I had a different kind of school life.

[interrupted by cell phone]

How much longer are we going to do this?

Q: Well, (?) just, maybe a little bit about the day---

Young: Sure.

Q: ---what happened?

Young: Yeah, it’s still very much in my memory. Well, I guess the day started out pretty normal, and I knew that at 9:30 I had to be at the Board of Ed, because I had written a letter of poor performance about a teacher and put it in his file, and he was filing a grievance and I had to go and testify. So I had to be there by 9:30---

[END TAPE ONE, SIDE ONE; BEGIN TAPE ONE, SIDE TWO]

---so I had my day, you know, like in the morning the kids came, and then I knew I was going to leave about nine o’clock, to take the F train down to Jay Street. So it was about ten to nine, all the kids were in class, they all came up and school started at 8:40, so I was in my office with my assistant principal, who is now the current principal, Jane. And I heard this like, big bang. And like this big boom, I never heard such a noise, and Jane said to me, “Is that thunder?” So I said, “I hope so.” It sounded like it. I never heard something like that.

Then the security officer came into my office, and he said, “They just bombed the World Trade Center.” So I said, “Oh, my God.” So I went, since we’re so close, the first thing I did was, you know, I called the district office, to find out if they knew anything. So I called Roy Moskowitz, who was the legal counsel, and I said, “Roy, what happened, did you hear that they, that the World Trade Center was bombed?” And he said, “No,” he said, “There was an accident, it was a small plane that hit the tower.” And so I said, “Okay,” I said, “That’s fine, as long as like, nothing terrible, I mean, okay, it was a terrible thing that a small plane, as soon as I got off the phone and not (?)

So then, Jane came running into the office again, and she says, “Alice, people are dying. You have to come outside. You have to see this.” And ‘cause we can see the towers from our school yard. So I ran outside, and I was with the school secretary, and I just saw this gaping hole and the tower was just all smoke billowing out, and we’restanding there, and all of a sudden, it just---the second tower just like exploded. But we didn’t see it, we were standing on the sidewalk and we didn’t see a plane hit it. I didn’t know what happened. I thought something happened, and ignited something in the other building. So we just like stood there, and I just, with Joyce, my secretary, and we kind of like hugged each other. I said, “Oh my god, what is going on?”

So we went back inside, and by that time, kids have seen it, ‘cause the kids in the south side of the building, right by the bridge can see it. So I got on the loudspeaker, and I said, “You know, there’s been an accident, something, there’s been an accident, and so, everything’s okay, we’re just going to go on as usual, just, everything’s alright.”

And then we heard on the news that there’s another plane that was hijacked and was headed toward the White House, and it was just like getting a little kind of crazy. And then we all, with the assistant principals, we walked through the building just to make sure everything was calm. And I just heard a lot of screaming in one classroom, so I went into the classroom, and they looked, and they saw the tower just collapsing. It was just like, horrible. So then we just----I got on the loudspeaker again, ‘cause I didn’t, first of all, I didn’t even know what was going on. And I said that, you know, “I know some of you have seen the towers collapsing, but let’s stay calm, and you know, we’re safe, we’re fine, we’re just going to be in the building.”

And then I got a call from the district office and they said that, don’t let any kids go home unless their parents pick them up. And I said, “Well, that’s great, how will they know to pick them up?” So we have a school board member in the building, who’s really great, and she called the Chinese radio, and to ask them to make an announcement that if your child is in school, please try to get to school as soon as you can and just pick up your children. And they’re not going to be dismissed until you pick them up.

So then, kids were, parents were coming, and picking them up, but I didn’t want to make an announcement and say, you know, John Lee, your mother is here, come to the main office. So we decided that we would just go up stairs and get the child, and just start, you know. And then I took classes of kids and we called---I took them to the office, and teachers would take them to one of the offices where there’s a phone and then call, and then by a quarter to seven, I think, every child was picked up. But it was like quite an experience. It was only, I think the second day of school, or the third day of school. And we had a family who was just admitted that day from China, the first day of school. And the grandmother came to---she didn’t want to---you know, she goes, “He belongs in school, let him stay in school.” I said, “No, well, you know, there’s this big catastrophe, and people just have to, we have to just empty out the school, ‘cause it’s really not safe, you should really take him home.” And her comment was, you know, “I grew up with war, I lived in a place where war was going on all the time.” I think she was from Cambodia, but she’s ethnically Chinese, so she said, “This is nothing. I don’t think it’s unsafe. He needs to be in school.”

So we really had to convince her to say, “Take your child home for now,” you know. And, but luckily, our families, we didn’t, there weren’t any, none of our families lost anyone there, because they don’t work at the Twin Towers, you know, so they work in the factories. But the area was devastated, because the kids---their parents lost their jobs, the factories were closed, this place was like, it was like a lockdown. And it was hard. You know, this was a --- this school was the relief center, for the Red Cross. So our school was closed for like two or three extra days, and we had families living here with the cots, and then when school, when we opened school, we couldn’t use our gymnasium in the basement, because it was still a relief center for families.

Q: Can you talk a little more about the effects, other effects of 9/11. You said a lot of kids’ parents lost jobs---

Young: Yeah, they did. They lost jobs, I mean we did a project with the kids, and they wrote about what was happening at home. Kids asked if we could have classes after school, because they just didn’t want to go home, because their parents were there. It was sad for them. They also, I --- to me, they wanted to do more schoolwork, and wanted after school tutoring because they felt that if they just do their work and do it well, that’s one thing their parents didn’t have to worry about. So that was something that we saw happening. And they just wanted to hang out at school. And then we got, we did get a lot of FEMA [Federal Emergency Management Agency] money, and I was wondering, like, so what should we do with this FEMA money? We got ninety-thousand dollars. Because I didn’t want it just to do more school work. So we sent a survey out to the kids, and asked them what they wanted to do. We asked teachers what their passion was.

And I told them, “We have ninety thousand dollars, so design your after school piece.” And I made it like, you know, you write a proposal, you know, just a mini-proposal, and I asked every school member, every teacher, guidance counselor, social worker, to just design your program. And you know, we have ninety thousand dollars which is a lot of money. And so teachers were great. And that’s how the oral history project came out, was one teacher decided to do this with the kids. A couple of teachers wanted to do poetry writing and poetry slam. Our Special Ed teacher, who had the mentally retarded children, he wanted to do cooking with them on Saturdays. I thought that was great, because, you know, these are children who have Down’s Syndrome, who have cerebral palsy, and if we could just have them in school for three hours, that gives the parents a break. And so he did this whole cooking thing, and they would shop, and they would cook, so he did it on Saturdays.

We bought---what did we buy? Guitars, and our music teacher gave guitar lessons, so we bought about fifteen guitars and he had fifteen kids and he taught them how to play guitar, you know, lessons. Another teacher did violin lessons. So it was really very nice. And teachers just did what they wanted to do. And wanted to teach. So, then of course we had the usual, you know, test prep kind of stuff, too. But the kids had a lot of fun. We used the gymnasium, they played chess, we had photography, so it was good. Yeah.

And then we got, like the New York Times gave us a lot of money to bring arts into the school, so during the school day we had a program where kids did digital photography, digital film-making. So it was this whole variety of things that kids did. Boys did knitting. It was fun. But it was hard, it was a big impact, and the kids really just weren’t used to having their parents around, you know, like their fathers and mothers in restaurants used to, they were never home, and then they just saw how depressing it was, and they didn’t want to be there. So this after school piece was really nice for them.

Q: Did they have, did they ever do anything directly related to 9/11? Like writing about it, or---

Young: Yeah, they did a lot of writing about it---one of our teachers, took them down to Nino’s Restaurant, and where Nino’s just served all the firefighters and all the rescue workers, and so they went there and they did this whole documentary about Nino’s Restaurant, and they raised money and they went down, they presented the check to the owner of Nino’s, and they sat and they talked to the---they interviewed the firefighters and the police officers and so they did this piece with their English teacher. And then they presented it to the rest of the school. They videotaped it, and it’s still here. You know, the teacher’s still here, they still have the projects. Kids wrote books, and then we had, like, we had a couple of people from Oklahoma come and visit, and talked about how it was in Oklahoma when that disaster happened over there. So it was, it brought this school together, brought the community together, and the teachers together, in terms of talking about it.

But we realized that you know, we did all of this outreach in trying to make sure the kids were taken care of, but I realized that the teachers were, needed that too. So we tried to use some of that ninety thousand dollars and other monies that we had, so we would have teachers come together and do some art therapy. And we had art therapy---in fact, we still have money coming from Project Liberty, which is the remnants of the 9/11 money, and this is our second year, or this is our---almost two and half years of art therapy, for our kids, and we’re still being, we’re still funded to the end of this year, and possibly next year. And the teachers just love it, ‘cause teachers got together during their lunch hour, and did this fabulous painting and just kind of own self-expression. We had people come in to do yoga with the teachers. We had aromatherapy for them.

Three times, people came for the massages, they like brought massage tables. And we set up this really nice, like, dim lights and candles and music, and during the teachers’ preparation time, they would sign up and come in for the---they had all massage tables and went all out getting a massage. That was really nice. And just ways to have teachers relax, and, you know, they had retreats for us. And some teachers went. And we realized that the adults needed too, you know, maybe more so than the kids, ‘cause they were so stressed out from this thing.

Q: Yeah.

Young: Yeah. It’s a big job to take care of thirteen hundred kids and over a hundred teachers.

Q: Yeah.

Young: You know?

Q: Is there a way---how did you, did you feel like you could tell how the kids were doing, or sort of processing?

Young: Yeah, well, you know, we had the counselors check in, and we had---but you know, I guess maybe it’s my own personality and how I view life, but my feeling was that, you know, okay, so, we grieved a little, but we have to move on. It’s enough. We have to just keep going. And I know there was a little kind of, tug and pull between some of the staff felt that I didn’t do enough, and didn’t provide enough of the compassion and all of this memory of and kind of continue commem---or just memorializing it, and that I should have spend more time, so I knew there was a certain group of teachers that felt that way. But I think it’s just, that’s me, that’s how I feel, I feel like we should just move on. But there was a little of that resistance where I know there were some teachers who felt like, Oh, you didn’t do enough, and you know, we should have done more, and, but I---my feeling is, it’s time to just move on.

[END OF INTERVIEW]

<p> 問﹕我們現在於131初中和楊鳳美一起，那麼，請你先介紹自己，說出你的名字。</p>
<p>楊﹕好的，我名叫楊鳳美。</p>
<p>問﹕請你講一些有關你在那裡出生﹖在那裡長大﹖你年幼時在那裡﹖</p>
<p>楊﹕當然，嗯，其實，我在曼哈頓出生，因為，唯一的華裔婦產科醫生就在曼哈頓，我在東15街出生，但在布碌崙居住，在布碌崙長大，一直都在布碌崙居住，我在那裡讀書，小學乃至大學，我都只留在—我簡直是布碌崙女孩(笑聲)。</p>
<p>問﹕所以，你在布碌崙的那邊﹖</p>
<p>楊﹕其實，我在一個名貴士省的鄰舍長大，爸爸擁有一間手洗洗衣店，有一間工廠專門熨摺裇衫，24小時有工人不停工作，我們居住，你知喇，一些朋友居在手洗洗衣店後面，我們就住在樓上，很多機器不停轉動，熨床之類，很嘈吵，我在那裡長大，直到結婚。<br>

問﹕那鄰舍是怎樣的﹖

楊﹕嗯，它叫貴士省，是意大利裔社區，其實，我住在麥當奴大道，F車就在那裡行走，是一條地上車軌，<br>

非常嘈吵，我記得我在大學時，一些人問我要電話號碼，當他打電話來時，他以為我借用了地車站的電話(笑聲)。</p>
<p>所以，我住在那裡，一直到23歲。</p>
<p>問﹕好的，那麼，你知道多少有關你父母的過去﹖他們怎樣到美國的﹖</p>
<p>楊﹕當然可以，我知道很多，其實，當家父來到這國家，他十三歲，和他爸爸及叔伯來，那時只有男性才移民，我猜想爸爸的叔伯在上州士嘉大有一間洗衣館，所以他們在那裡居住一段短時間，然後，因為和華人缺乏交往，他們決定來到紐約市到華埠來，那時在華埠有柏文或社團，又有寡佬柏文給年青人居住，他們就到來住下，就在擺也街。<br>

然後祖父在布碌崙帝王大道開了一間洗衣館，我想爸爸以前說他想離開華人遠一點，所以就搬出華埠，他那時已常常留在布碌崙，但仍未定居下來，後來他們開了一家洗衣店，爸爸說他那時15歲，又住在那裡，我的祖父，你知喇，只想來到這裡，賺錢、儲錢、寄錢返中國，希望有一天返回中國。</p>
<p>後來，祖父病了，想返中國，因為那是他的家鄉，他想回去，於是我爸爸及叔伯就留下來，有趣的是，當我爸爸那時將近18歲，他們就叫他回鄉下娶老婆，爸爸於是回去，結了婚，等到大哥出世後，爸爸就留哥哥在鄉下，自己回來這裡做工，<br>

約在八年後，又回中國，其後我的二哥出生(笑聲)。</p>
<p>所以，每次他每次返鄉下，就生一個孩子，在1949年，共產黨來，控制了中國，到南京，爸爸就決定，找一個律師，決定將家庭帶來美國﹕接我的哥哥及媽媽來美，然後，他想儲蓄及回中國養老的想法就沒有了，他明白每個人應該移民這裡，因為他不再想返回中國了，這是他們移民的因由。<br>

問﹕好的，他們經過很多困難才能到來嗎﹖例如護照及……﹖</p>
<p>楊﹕是呀﹗嗯﹗你知道喇﹗他要得到，嗯，其實，他的洗衣館的地區非常，我猜是富有的鄰舍，他的顧客是醫生、律師等，有一個律師定時將衣服交給爸爸洗，爸爸開始問他，你也知道喇，諸如之類的問題﹕「我怎樣申請家人到來﹖我有家人……」然後，他帶所有文件，你知道喇，給律師，做應該做的事，於是，在1949年，爸爸回到中國，就開始辦文件申請家人來這裡，家中有個笑話，是因為我在1950年出生，媽媽在香港懷了我，在1950年5月來美時正懷孕中，所以我好像是家中第一個小孩，你知道喇，是在美國生的第一個小孩。<br>

問﹕所以，你家一共多少個孩子﹖

楊﹕一共五個，我有三個哥哥，比我大，全部在……，兩個在中國，一個在香港出生，然後我們來這裡，他們來美國之後生了我，再生一個妹妹。</p>
<p>問﹕所以五個人都在貴士省﹖在布碌崙長大﹖

<br>

楊﹕是呀，在布碌崙，但不要忘記我的年紀和長兄相差一大截，我的意思是，他幾乎可以做我的爸爸，他來時已經結了婚。</p>
<p>問﹕是的嗎﹖他和他太太一起來嗎﹖</p>
<p>楊﹕嗯，他起初沒有帶妻子來，移民法當時規定他可以先來，然後再申請妻子，他來時已經和妻子在中國結了婚。<br>

問﹕好的，在那時候，50年代，你的成長經歷是怎樣的，你剛才提及你在意大利人鄰舍中長大﹖</p>
<p>楊﹕是啊，那是十分意大利的鄰舍，妹妹和我是在整間學校中唯一的華人家庭孩子，我不知道，不太記得小學的事情了，只是…….，爸媽管教很嚴，你知喇，我時常要照顧妹妹，她只比我小13個月，主要概念是，你不需要朋友，下課後不要到處跑，只要下課後返家做功課，所以你就，你知喇，上學，返家，很多上學，返家，然後，我爸爸…..，我那時不太明白，但現在明白他為什麼那麼做，我們家中沒有電視，他堅持我們在家中講中文，不講英文，又沒有任何玩具，我們時常做功課，及寫字，他又有間洗衣店，我們做完功課後，就到樓下幫忙。</p>
<p>所以他，我猜他的人生哲學是，我媽說他常常說﹕「嗯，他們什麼都不懂，怎會學到英文﹖」所以他說﹕「我們不懂英文也不怕。」他只怕我們喪失中國文化之類，所以，你知喇，他在家保留每一樣中國的東西，我們不許講一點英文。記得在三年級，我們多次央求父母後，終於得到了一部電視，於是，有一天，我讀三年級時，<br>

爸爸來接我放學，用車載我到Sears(百貨店) ，我們買了第一部電視機。當電視送來我家時，到現在我仍記得那是星期五的下午，我們只有一個客廳，但不是，你知喇，又有一張沙發及枱，要有一個地方放置電視，我和妹妹原本坐兩張摺椅，就將電視擱在那裡，他們送電視來，我們接上電源，那是在7台，播放美國樂隊節目，我不知道電視是什麼，又是如何操作，我們就讓它一直開著，也不知道可以轉到其他頻道之類，所以每天我們都收看美國樂隊節目，然後我返學校告訴同學，你知喇，我有電視，他們就說﹕「多好，你有沒有看這、看那節目﹖」你知喇，那些表演，我就說﹕「你講什麼﹖」然後我們決定轉動那些電視按鈕，然後我發現，你知喇，我們可以轉動，可以看其他節目，我回想，「噢，我們真是被受保護的一群。」</p>
<p>問﹕你沒有其他朋友﹖</p>
<p>楊﹕不很多，我的意思是，你知喇，我的父母不准我們到別人家中，肯定也不讓別人到我家，他們時常在樓下工作，我們在樓上，我可以看電影、或讀書、或、你知喇，打架(笑聲)，我和妹妹。有時，就算在學校，要合作做報告，同時，放學後，要一起走，要一起做研究項目，我們要花很多精神說服爸爸，出外需要大條理由的，我們……。</p>
<p>然後，他就駕車載我們到同學家，又接我們回來，我們要這樣做，你知喇。</p>
<p>問﹕為了讀書才可以。</p>
<p>楊﹕為了讀書，是呀﹗</p>

<p> 問﹕那你們講什麼中國方言﹖

楊﹕我們講廣東話。<br>

問﹕好的，那你家庭來自那裡﹖

楊﹕嗯，他們來自，那時叫廣東，現在叫廣州，在南部一個省份，我想，那縣份叫台山，所以我們說台山話，我猜是，你知喇。</p>
<p>每星期我們都到中文學校，好像既定儀式一樣。</p>
<p>問﹕學校在那裡﹖</p>
<p>楊﹕在華埠，你知喇，那時不像現在可以在布碌崙買中國蔬菜之類，所以，每個星期日如同旅行般，我們吃中國餐，然後出來上中文學校，由下午一時至三時，父母來接我們，那裡有一間電影院，爸爸會給我們25仙，那時候25仙可以用很久了，我們到電影院，媽媽愛看中國舞台劇，你知喇，中國電影，我們就可以看那些，我們吃晚餐，大約在晚上八時回家，我們就是這樣過星期日。<br>

問﹕每個星期日，自少如此。</p>
<p>楊﹕每個星期日，是呀，一直如此，我猜，直到初中就停止了，因為我不用再讀中文學校。</p>
<p>問﹕所以，你和華人社區有多少聯繫，除了……</p>

<p> 楊﹕沒有，並不很多，你知喇，只和家人一起，我們在華埠做的事不多，除了看電影、讀中文學校，及吃晚餐，僅此而已。</p>
<p>問﹕你有沒有祖父母輩﹖你說過你爸爸的叔伯在這裡，他們在這裡有家庭嗎﹖

楊﹕嗯，其實有，嗯，他們都返中國，又過世了，但爸爸有兄弟在這裡，我的叔伯及嬸母，及堂兄弟姐妹，家族，你知喇，都頗大，但相對其他家庭仍不算大。</p>
<p>問﹕你常見到他們嗎﹖

楊﹕我們在星期日到華埠時見到他們，我們在勿街22號蔬菜店，我們整個家族，大部份住在布碌崙，到華埠買東西，你知喇，爸爸駕車，他買了很多很多蔬菜，因為洗衣店整日開放，八小時一班，大部份老闆都供應午、晚餐食，我媽媽為約50人煮食，弄午餐、晚餐，然後下一班工人又來，後來他們聘請一個會煮飯的，弄餐，早上兩輪午餐，於是她不停地煮大型菜，在洗衣館大約有50人和我們一起吃飯。<br>

問﹕所以，洗衣館有多大﹖</p>
<p>楊﹕巨型，巨型，像，可能比這整間圖書館還要大，有五座熨壓機器，約13部熨斗，14熨台、男工人熨衣及摺衣，我們將衣放入盒，送出店面及其他洗衣店。</p>
<p>問﹕所以，這些工人都來自那裡﹖</p>

<p> 楊﹕大部份來自華埠，他們乘地車來，長時間工作，我意思是，早班一班由早八時至晚八時，晚班由八時至早上八時，大部份是一星期六天，你知喇，我們工作很勤勞。</p>
<p>問﹕你說你爸爸大概要離開華埠，他有沒有告訴你原因﹖</p>
<p>楊﹕嗯，我猜他想我們長大時離開，我不太清楚，他覺得他不想我們受影響，我不太清楚，那時也不多像70及80年代的黨派問題，他只覺得，我不太清楚為什麼，他說，他用奇怪的表情說，他說當華人都遷入那鄰舍，你就應該遷出去(笑聲)，我不太清楚為什麼，他只，我不太清楚，他只覺得他要我們，雖然在家不講英文，他想我們在比較像居宅區的地方成長，不像一些地方到處都是餐館及細小柏文，我們住的地方很寬闊，每人有一個房間，很好。</p>
<p>問﹕我們要講快一點，講你進大學的生活。</p>
<p>楊﹕ 是呀，我入大學，入讀布碌崙學院，你知喇，爸爸將恤衫送到很多洗衣店，他時常，到那裡都好，都駕駛到布碌崙學院附近，這偌大校園有鐘樓及尖塔，他對我說，「你知道嘛，你們將到這裡唸書，這是大學。」它就在四角型道口的終端，從百福大道一直望到底就是布碌崙學院。不知道為什麼，他送衣服時往往要走在百福大道近布碌崙學院，我猜給我們形成根深柢固的概念，當我申請大學時，我並沒有申請很多學校，他也不會讓我們離開的，我們甚至沒有去想。</p>

<p> 於是我入了大學，入讀布碌崙學院，然後我自己駕車，我學駕車，我問﹕「爸爸怎樣去的呢﹖」就好像，我不曾去想，它看來很宏偉，不像在布碌崙區的中心，於是，我也和妹妹一同，當然妹妹也進了布碌崙學院。好像我們的志願是要入大學，我猜幸好爸爸讓我們唸大學，因為我高中很多朋友，我長大時有自己的朋友，有些朋友成為爸爸的顧客，我開始有華裔的社交圈子，基本上是因為我和爸爸收集衣服而結識的，他們和我年紀相若，又合得來，很多女孩子不能唸大學，因為他們的父母覺得要為兒子儲錢，給他們讀大學，或他們認為女孩子不應該唸大學，所以我的華裔高中同學裡，我想，我和妹妹是少數能夠唸大學的孩子。</p>
<p>問﹕你覺得你爸爸和別人有所不同，是因為什麼﹖

楊﹕因為他真的相信教育，他真的說過，你要讀書，讀大學，無論是仔是女都好，我想他時常灌輸給我們，我們應讀好書，一代比一代好，不應像他一樣做牛做馬，一天工作十五小時。所以，我們時常努力做得最好，全力以赴，但他只覺得，向上的方法是我們要上學，這是美國，我們在這裡，就是要讀書，你知喇，我們真的很努力，但很困難，因為他們不能幫助我們，他們不懂很多英文，我記得我要寫一個報告，我需要百科全書，他又不准我們到圖書館，是不是﹖他不能明白，我也未能向他解釋百科全書是什麼，我只告訴他那是一本書，我們需要這些書，到圖書館那裡找，所以他的反應是﹕「我會買給你們，在那裡買﹖」然後我們走入書店，我們問，我們問那人要一套百科全科，他望著我們好像要說﹕「你們傻了嗎﹖不能在這裡買的。」那時有一個顧客走進來，他說﹕「我有一套智慧之書(Book of Knowledge)，但失了一本L，<br>

你要不要買﹖」我爸爸於是買了給我們，那是又舊又爛，很多破繩頭在書脊掉出來，然後他買了給我們，我們就用那智慧之書。</p>
<p>然後，那幫我們全家來的律師，為我們做很多事，他為爸爸寫支票，處理所有賬單，每星期六我們都見他，帶餅食糕點及報紙，我爸爸付款，送給他，像是逢星期六的禮儀，我們給他洗好的衣服，洗熨他的衣服，摺好，帶回去，我們問他，他說﹕「噢，你想，你真的想要麼﹖」我說﹕「是的」，然後我爸爸用了三百元，那時候是很多錢，他買了整套世界百科全書，連同書架，每年要加新書，你知喇，我想那時我在五年級，有自己的一整套百科全書。</p>
<p>所以，他想為我們預備我們需要的，那很難辦得到，因為他不懂英文，我記得我需要釘書機，真的不知道在那裡買，所以，他駕車載我們，從布碌崙一直到華埠勿街Waku書店，買了這個回旋牌釘書機，我仍然保存它，你知喇，那些事很有趣，但在成長當時使人感到挫折。</p>
<p>問﹕是嗎﹖</p>
<p>楊﹕是呀﹗</p>
<p>問﹕所以……，你進入高中後，有一些朋友。</p>
<p>楊﹕是呀，在高中開始有一些朋友，然後入大學，你知喇，我們要搜索自己的路，很多女孩子不能讀大學，然後在大學，我結識了這圈子的朋友，基本上是華裔，我參加了中國同學會，然後一年後，妹妹入大學，我們都有很多社交，<br>

其實，我現在仍然和那些大學朋友保持密切聯繫。</p>
<p>問﹕所以，你的朋友大部份和你背景相似﹖

楊﹕是呀，是呀，很相近，他們家人基本上也開洗衣店，在相近背景成長，又在美國出生，很相近。</p>
<p>問﹕那時在布碌崙學院很多那樣的人嗎﹖

楊﹕是呀，基本上，是呀。</p>
<p>問﹕那你在大學時，你主修什麼﹖</p>
<p>楊﹕我主修教育，我一直知道我喜歡教書，我有一個姪兒，是哥哥的兒子，你知喇，姪兒父母離了婚，他大約兩歲，要住在我家，我喜歡照顧他，帶著他，我讀高中，帶他上學，接他放學，大學一年級時，很有趣，我見到他的老師們，年青，很好，他們有自己的車及其他，我很喜歡照顧姪兒，所以也很喜歡教導他，我時常想這樣做，所以我主修教育，讀了四年，實習教書，也很喜歡。我時常，然後，我畢業，在71年畢業生，那時，教師過剩，所以我到托兒所工作，和三歲半小孩一起，不是很有趣，他們睡覺，又生意外，醒來時又哭鬧。<br>

我在那裡工作差不多半年，然後做代課教師，在第一學區，然後，在72年開始教書，之後一直在學校工作。</p>
<p>問﹕你一直到大學也和父母一起住嗎﹖</p>

<p> 楊﹕是呀，我住在家裡，和父母一起，1973年結婚，就搬出去，很刺激(笑聲)，真的很刺激。</p>
<p>問﹕所以，你和誰結婚﹖

楊﹕我丈夫，大衛，他其實，我不知道，我猜他是進口來的，他在羅徹斯特生長，他的…..，我和他老表在同一大學，於是就認識了他，當他來到紐約市，就住在……，他也是教師，來到紐約市找教席，我因他老表而認識他，在同一大學唸書，所以……。</p>
<p>問﹕然後你們搬到那裡去﹖</p>
<p>楊﹕(笑聲)，真的很遠呀，距離父母家三條街遠，我們住了好一陣子，然後我父母賣了有洗衣館那座房子，我的妹妹也住在家中，他們第一次賣了房子租住柏文，因為我爸爸時常都是住自己買來的房子，他喜歡自己當老闆，有自己的事業，有自己的房子，他第一次租住柏文交租，和妹妹一起住了三年。</p>
<p>問﹕那柏文在你附近﹖

楊﹕不，他們嘗試住在兩哩外，三年，然後租金高漲，爸爸不能忍受，於是妹妹建議我們看房子，合作一起買，我說好呀，你知道喇，她找到一間十六房間的兩家庭，我們買下來，住到現在，妹妹和父母先住，在二樓，我和大衛住在一樓。</p>

<p> 問﹕房子在那裡﹖

楊﹕那在，我猜在海軍公園區，仍舊在布碌崙，我們住到現在，我有兩個孩子，父母過世了，妹妹結了婚，然後又買了自己的房子，然後，我們就買了妹妹那一份，房子完全屬於自己了。</p>
<p>問﹕你一直住在那裡﹖</p>
<p>楊﹕從1978年至現在，我不是喜歡搬家的人，不會離開鄰舍的，但我喜歡住在布碌崙，很寧靜，又，但…..，很方便，但現在，我要教書，七零年代在下東城教書，市府財政短絀，我被解僱，轉到史丹頓島教書，然後又在布碌崙教，後來生了孩子，就在皇冠高地教書，那是一個品流複雜、很多印第安裔學生、很貧困的地區，你知喇，日子過得很好，我教書很開心，但回到家中，自從有兒子後，好像，天呀，掙扎很大，你知喇，很多掙扎，因為孩子需要很大。</p>
<p>在晚上，我時常到華埠教書，教成人英語，十五年了，每日我在布碌崙教書，逢星期二、四晚上七時半至十時就到華埠教英文，和華埠社區的成人在一起，我的中文進步了，雖然我教的是英文，但有機會用中文及其他，我想過到華埠教書，所以我在1985年到第一小學任教五、六年級，歷時十一年，那是在我成為校長之前。</p>
<p>問﹕好的，你是否一直教小學﹖</p>
<p>楊﹕是呀，我的執照是小學老師，時常教五、六年級。</p>

<p> 問﹕然後，你什麼時候來這裡﹖

楊﹕1996年。</p>
<p>問﹕好的，是否在第一小學之後，你就來這裡﹖</p>
<p>楊﹕是呀，是在第一小學之後，當我教第一小學時，我的校長真是我的師長，從她身上我學到很多，她會說﹕「你為什麼不做校長﹖」她不是中國人，覺得社區需要華人，「你可以，」她相信她是孩子及家長的模範，她說﹕「你何不讀書，回到學校讀書，取得校長執照﹖那是說，你可以成為孩子的模範，幫助家長。」那我決定，你知喇，那很好，因為我明白華人父母來到學校，只是因為他們知道有華人教師，感覺到可以向老師訴說，你知喇，他們可以有同聲同氣的人，在首次見面溝通良好，你知喇，坦白地說，他們對非亞裔人並不能坦然講話，你知喇，就是那種感覺鬆弛、舒暢的效果。<br>

於是我在晚上上學，獲得由紐約市立大學及教育部發出的獎學金，讀了一年，取得證書，成為校長，後來他們要聘請一個人，當時小學不再包括六年級，六年級變成初中的一部份，初中有六、七、八年級，所以校監問我要不要再做初中副校長，我很怕，因為我從來未，未教過初中，校監就說，即管教，他希望初中變成較近小學的模式，孩子獲得培育，不單止像初中。於是，我在九六年成為副校長，然後那校長也是新的，有很多事要辦，他同年四月問我要不要做校長，<br>

然後我在九七年四月成為校長，直至2003年六月。</p>
<p>問﹕你覺得做校長和做教書有什麼不同﹖</p>
<p>楊﹕那是，你知喇，我從教室出來，走進1400名孩子、120名教師的巨大地方，那真是邊學邊做，你知道嗎﹖我記得問其他校長，找其他校長來幫忙，我每晚打電話問問題，但你知喇，我要學逐步站起來，要很快思考，很多事情要在一瞬間作決定，我想起前校長告訴我的﹕「將孩子放在第一位，當你做決定時，時常確定孩子在你的第一位，那你的決定就一定為孩子的益處著想。」因為，你知喇，這學校非常傳統，我認為，亦不是用最好的教學方法，所以，要改變學校轉到別的方向，可能令成年人及很多教師不安，但我做的每一個決定，都要遵照一個原理，就是是否為了孩子的益處著想﹖那是比較容易決定的，我認為如你有一套關於如何管理課室，或孩子應如果學習的哲學、或目標、或只是一個圖象，事情就容易得多了。</p>
<p>但是當然，很多人不高興學校的轉變，沒有人喜歡轉變的，但是，你知喇，有時事情是要發生的。</p>
<p>問﹕傳統學校相對於學校有什麼不同﹖</p>
<p>楊﹕是呀﹗嗯﹗你知喇，傳統教學是我以前上學的一套，你知喇，學生排排坐，老師在前面教書，老師講學，你讀書，回答問題，這一套，孩子和老師很少對話，老師時時主宰，老師在教書，我的思考是比較激進的，我認為老師應引導學生，應幫忙孩子如何問問題，當孩子問問題時，他們應，好像，我們應引導他們找尋答案，<br>

然後才獲得知識，所以知識不一定從我而來，因為我不知道所有事情，孩子應自己問問題及做自己的研究。<br>

同時，我真的相信，你知喇，在學堂以外的學習，如到博物館或文化機構，有專家或講者到來，是另外一種教育方法，具備那些信念，又身為這學校的校長，現時孩子排排坐及老師站在前面教書，用一本教科書，你知喇，很難，很難才可轉變，但是，你知喇，我認為孩子真的很喜歡學習。</p>
<p>問﹕你可以講一些關於這間學校的事嗎﹖例如學生的背景﹖</p>
<p>楊﹕噢，嗯，當然可以，這學校中，87或88個百分點是亞裔孩子，96或97個百分點有免費午餐資格，意思是我的學校屬第一條款，我猜屬貧窮線以下，貧窮線是91個百分點，但我們的學生在學區內有最高的出席率，97個百分點，15個百分點的孩子是西、非裔，10個百分點是特殊教育孩子，一半孩子是英語學習者，即他們的英文程度不足，未通過英語流利程度猜試，他們需要額外幫助，被強制學英語。<br>

那是一個雙語計劃，每級約有120至150名孩子，在那裡接受一些用母語教授的科目，大部份時間我們用中文教社會及及數學，在雙語教育班學中文及數學的學生，成績比普通學生好，因為他們本來具備這種數學技考，只是英文一環缺乏流利，所以我們基本上用中文教，你知喇，用中文講數學概念。</p>

<p> 問﹕你面對這麼多不會講英文的孩子，或不講英文的家長，有什麼挑戰及困難﹖</p>
<p>楊﹕是呀，嗯，你知喇，那挑戰是推動他們學習英文，我們也，你知喇，教他們母語，我們嘗試，希望英文程度增進也同時保持一些中文讀、寫、聽及講的程度，引起他們動機，不致氣餒，因為，你知喇，孩子知道他們非常落後，很難跟得上程度，當然不想被踢出校，他們來的年紀是13、14歲，就讀八年級，你知喇，心中被很多事情困擾，所以我們引起他們學習動機，讓他們留下來，所以，我們就，你知喇，我們引進一套完整的文藝課程，我們有很好的老師，如此，可令孩子對舞蹈、藝術或戲劇科產生讀、寫及講的興趣。<br>

你知喇，我們有棋藝會，有攝影會，我們想繼續這些會，不一定成功，但基本上孩子留下來讀書，畢業，希望他們能升讀好的高中，能照顧他們的需要。</p>
<p>問﹕你和學生的家長有多少聯繫﹖</p>
<p>楊﹕唔，你知喇，我們掙扎很大，很難得到家長參與校務，我想因為那是西方概念，來學校、講出需要、受到歡迎，你知喇，尤其是華埠的家長，他們工作時間很長，他們只……，文化上，你知喇，他們覺得我的孩子在你的學校，你是專家，你是教育專家，現在我出去做工，你們也做你們的份內事，他們也不知道家長參與等西方概念。我們想家長參與，但很難得到家長前來，就算是家長日，或籌款會，因為我們的家長，你知喇，貧窮，需要長時間工作。我知道今年，市長加添了「家長協調員」的職位，他們特別推動家長參與，<br>

我知道這學校來開會的家長增加了兩、三倍，因為家長協調員親自打電話給他們，告訴他們「請來開會」，所以有一個人用全時間照顧家長、向家長作出調查、找出他們的需要，這是很聰明的做法，是彭博市長的德政，做得很好。</p>
<p>問﹕當家長向你訴說時，你覺得你可以令他們更舒服嗎﹖</p>
<p>楊﹕可以呀。</p>
<p>問﹕像是有個方法，仍然有一個鴻溝，因為你在這裡生長，而他們是……。</p>
<p>楊﹕是呀，的確有個鴻溝，然後我—現在這個社區的人口，很多時有很多福建家長前來，而很多時候，我也未能與他們溝通，因為他們講國語及福建話，而我只說廣東話，我發現這鴻溝越來越大，但我依賴翻譯，依賴孩子作翻譯，意思是，有時我要了解孩子，要透過三個人才明白其訊息，我確定當中一些訊息會輾轉消失，所以很難，但我想學校的溫馨，現在學校的文化不同了，令結果也不同，我想最大的分別是有了學校協調員，你知喇，就會做得更好。<br>

問﹕你看見其他轉變嗎﹖

楊﹕在學校﹖</p>
<p>問﹕是呀，從96年至去年你離開時。</p>

<p> 楊﹕嗯，那肯定孩子學習的方式，我是那種不用單一本教科書的人，所以我們的課室擺滿了不同程度的書籍，我真的相信我們找出孩子的程度、孩子的喜好、儘量給孩子那些書及需要的，你知喇，孩子一起學習，比較以發問為主，孩子問問題，當我初來時，學校很肅靜，你不見孩子講話，因為老師安排他們排排坐，主要由教師講話，但現在，你知喇，孩子很高興，和其他孩子講話，我們分成小組讀書，搞文學圈子，你知喇，孩子就學習了，我帶進來不同的人群和學生一起工作，尤其是文藝科，我們時常和美洲華埠博物館、分享藝術長老、亞美藝術中心、等機構保持聯繫，你知喇，對面的李萊街建築師，如你到喜士打街夾愛烈治街看看，我們和李萊街建築師公司合作一個項目，為時兩年，三十名孩子的工作項目，將對面街頭當成課室，改變街角，將一小片土地變得更好，令公眾對社區那角落產生良好深刻的印象。<br>
<br>
然後他們真的做得很好，用建築學的角度做研究，研究那地帶的光線、噪音、噪音的種類、路過人群數目，對這小角落作出規劃，決定如何使用這小片地，令它更吸引人，令人印象更深刻，於是他們產生了願望井的概念，建造了小小的願望井，用鑲嵌階磚堆砌而成，所以如你看看這角落，我不知道你是否看過，看看它，又看看他們在牆壁上砌瓷磚的手工，這是兩年長的項目，然後他們做這些金屬雕塑如風鈴，然後掛起來，像十呎高，他們做得到。上星期我們舉行了開幕禮，真的很好。那是學習的方式，孩子應這樣學習，那很難，因為，家長未習慣那種教學方式，來自中國的孩子也不是這樣學習，所以我們要慢慢實行。我記得在學期初，當我初來時，我們沒有教科書，只有普通書籍，<br>

你知喇，所以家長真的不安，他們說﹕「天呀﹗沒有書，教科書在那裡﹖屈拿高中那裡有教科書呢﹗」我說﹕「你知道嗎﹖」我透過翻譯解釋，學區委員又來支持我，我告訴他們，你知喇，如你到書店買第二次世界大戰的書，你知喇，你不會得到一本教科書，內中有兩、三段講第二次世界的，你可以得到一本書講第二次世界大戰的戰爭，或第二次世界大戰的總統，那是孩子應有的學習方式，因為教科書只是公司賺學校金錢的形式。」<br>

所以慢慢地，你知喇，開始轉變，現在家長不再疑慮，他們明白那是學習的方式，他們以往曾說不願去博物館之類，就會告訴我﹕「嗯，你知喇，他們去年才去過。」就算華人描述遊覽，也直譯為遊玩，或者….，所以我告訴家長﹕「嗯，那是好的，我們去到的時候，會填這個功課表，我們將看看這些，孩子將會學習地球科學，我們去博物館是看石頭。」</p>
<p>所以，他們終於明白到，於是我不用再解說，我們為什麼要走出學校，或探訪其他地方了，那很好。</p>
<p>問﹕聽來，你的思想很前衛進，你如何產生這些觀念﹖因為你似乎來自很傳統的學派。</p>
<p>楊﹕是呀，其實，我受益於第二學區，因為我是那區的教師，安東尼．阿法拉度是學區學監，他真的讓教師離開教室，互相學習，互相到訪觀摩教學及閱讀方式，所以我們閱讀了很多專業書籍，討論了很多，看了不同的教導方法及兒童學習方式，做了很多研究，我認為這些令我明白教學是什麼，不單是接受，因為我那時在布碌崙教書，你知喇，他們給你書叫你用，從沒有對話，我從沒參加工作坊，從不用走出校門，<br>

校長從不閱讀書籍，或討論，或說我們應如何教書，我們不曾互訪。但當我到第二學區，我們互訪，然後我就明白，你知喇，以往我的學年像模糊不清，並不刺激，我做只是因為我被叫去做，我知道如果我的成績不好，爸爸會很憤怒。</p>
<p>小時候父母不准我去任何地方，所以我要留在家中閱讀，然後，你知喇，我開始教書時，變成一個較好的閱讀者，在閱讀時能夠發出問題，及加以討論。本來我在工作坊中很難講得好，你知喇，對那本書有反思、如何和日常生活有連繫，對我很難，因為從少不容許我發問、或講述感受或想法，所以我要特別學習如何表達，我想在其中的學習過程，我對教學的看法不同了，因為那不是我以前學習的方式，你知喇，我想我不知道答案，但我想如果學習方式不同的時候，那會有什麼結果﹖我不知道答案。如果我的學校生活截然不同時，我又會變成怎樣﹖</p>
<p>[手提電話打斷了。]</p>
<p>還要多少時間﹖</p>
<p>問﹕嗯，只是，可能還有少部份，有關你的日常工作。</p>
<p>楊﹕好的。</p>
<p>問﹕---什麼事﹖</p>
<p>楊﹕是呀，在記憶中很多事，嗯，今天開始工作如常，九時半我就要到教育局，<br>

因為我寫了一名老師的壞表現記錄，放在他的檔案內，他遞了勞資糾紛的投訴，我要去作證，所以我九時半到了那裡。</p>
<p>[第一盒錄音帶第一面完畢，第二面開始]</p>
<p>所以我在那一天，你知喇，像早上孩子上學一樣，我記得我要在九時離開，乘F車到Jay街站，那時約八時五十分，所有孩子都在課室，課堂從八時四十分就開始，我和副校長珍在辦公室內，她是現任校長，我聽到呯一聲，從來未聽過的巨響，珍問我﹕「那是行雷聲嗎﹖」我說﹕「希望是，」那聲音像是我從來未聽過的。</p>
<p>然後警衛走進我的辦公室，他說，「他們爆炸了世貿，」於是我說﹕「老天爺﹗」我馬上…，因為我們距離很近，我做的第一件事，你知喇，打電話給學區，要找出他們知道什麼，我找到諾．莫可維茲，是法律顧問，我說﹕「諾，發生什麼事﹖有沒有聽過，他們爆炸了世貿中心﹖」他說﹕「不。」他說﹕「那是意外，有架小飛機撞到一座世貿。」於是我說﹕「好的。」我說﹕「只要不是恐怖活動就好了，我意思是指，如果是一只小飛機撞進世界還好，我掛上電話，又不是了(?)」</p>
<p>然後，珍又跑來辦公室，她說﹕「愛麗斯，很多人死了，你要出來看看。」因為我們從操場可以看到世貿中心，於是我跑出去，和學校秘書一起，我看見世貿中心很多洞，很多煙噴出來，我們站在那裡，忽然間，第二座世貿好像爆開了，我們站在行人路，並沒有看見飛機撞到它，不知道發生什麼事，我以為第一座大樓發生一些事，燃點著第二座大樓，我們只呆呆站在那裡，我只和秘書喬伊斯互相抱緊，我說﹕「老天爺，發生什麼事﹖」</p>

<p> 我們返回去，那時候，孩子也看見了，因為面向南面、近橋的方向的孩子看見了，我打開擴音器說﹕「你知嘛，意外發生了，一些意外，所以，一切正常，我們如正常活動，一切安好。」</p>
<p>然後，我們在新聞中聽到另一架飛機被劫持正飛往白宮，事情好像有點瘋狂，我們和副校長，繞學校跑了一圈確定我們安全，一切安靜，我又剛聽見一間課室很多人喊叫，於是跑進去，他們看見世貿中心正在倒塌，很恐怖，然後我只有再次提起擴音器，因為首先，我們根本不知道發生什麼事，你知喇，我就說﹕「我知道你們當中一些人看見世貿大樓倒塌，但我們要保持鎮靜，你知道，我們安全，我們很好，我們繼續留在校園中。」</p>
<p>然後學區辦公室打電話來，他們說﹕除非家長接他們，不要讓學生回家，我說﹕「嗯，很好，家長如何知道要接放學呢﹖」我們有一個學委正在學校中，她很好，她打電話到華語的電台，叫他們宣佈，如你是家長，有孩子在學校，請儘快接孩子走，如學生不被接走，學校不會關門。</p>
<p>然後，小孩被接走，家長接他們，但我們不想宣佈，像說，李約翰，你的媽媽來了，來校務處。開始時，我們決定要跑上樓梯取孩子，你知喇，然後我帶走一群孩子，我叫名，帶他們到校務處，老師帶他們到有電話的辦公室打電話，然後在六時四十五分，我想所有孩子都被接走了，但事情很驚險，我想在其後的第二天或第三天，我們遇到一個家庭剛從中國來，孩子第一天入學，和祖母來，她不想，你知喇，她說﹕「他屬於學校，讓他留在學校，」我說﹕<br>

「不，嗯，你知道，這裡發生大災難，人們要，我們要學校清場，因為不安全，你真的要將他帶回家去。」她評論，你知喇，說﹕「我是打仗大的，我住的地方時時打仗。」我想她是從柬埔寨來的，但她是華裔，所以她說﹕「這不算什麼事，我不覺得不安全，他需要在學校。」</p>
<p>所以，我們費勁要令她相信﹕「現在要帶孩子回去。」你知喇，幸好，我們的家庭，沒有，沒有家庭喪失親人，因為他們不在雙子塔工作，你知喇，他們在工廠工作，但地區被毁壞了，因為孩子……，其家長喪失工作，工廠被關閉，這地區好像是高度防備監獄，很困難，你知喇，這學校成為紅十字會的救援中心，我們的學校關閉了另外兩或三天，我們進駐了家庭和偵測系統，然後當學校重開時，我們未能使用地庫的體育場，因為它仍然用作家庭的救援中心。</p>
<p>問﹕你可否講一些後遺症，9/11的其他後遺症﹖你說很多孩子的父母喪失工作…….。</p>
<p>楊﹕是呀，他們失去工作，我意思是，我們和孩子做一項工作，記錄他們家中發生的事，學生問我們可否在課後補習，因為他們不想回家，因為父母在家，孩子不開心，他們都，對我說，他們想多做功課，想多點課後補習，因為功課做得好，家長就不需擔心，我們就知道發生一些事，他們想多留在學校。然後我們獲得很多聯邦緊急處理機構撥款(FEMA)，我就籌算怎樣處理這筆錢，我們獲九萬元，而我不想只用來做功課，故此我們叫孩子做了調查，問他們想做些什麼，我們也詢問老師學生的意向如何。</p>

<p> 於是我們告訴他們﹕「我們得到九萬元，來設計課後班。」我講得好像，你要寫計劃書，你知喇，一份小型計劃書，我問每一名學校成員，每位老師、輔導、社工，設計你的課程，你知喇，我們有九萬元，很多錢，老師很好，一名老師決定和學生做口述歷史計劃，這就成了這計劃﹔有幾位老師想寫詩文﹔我們的特殊教育老師，在星期六教弱智孩子煮食，我認為都是好，因為，你知喇，他們有智障，腦痙攣，我們可以留他們在學校多三小時，給家長一個休息空間，於是老師完成整個煮食課程，他們在星期六可以買東西及煮食。</p>
<p>我們買了，買了什麼﹖結他，我們的音樂老師教結他，買了十五個結他，同時可教十五個孩子，教他們學結他，你知喇，結他課﹔另一位老師教小提琴，那真的很好。老師可以做他想做，想教的，然後當然我們有平日的，你知喇，測驗準備等，但孩子多了樂趣，我們運用運動室，下棋，我們也有攝影班，那很好，是呀﹗<br>

然後，我們有，如時代週刊，給我們很好錢讀文藝科，於是在上課日我們的孩子有數碼相機及數碼電影製作課程，所以，孩子做很多事情，男孩子編織，很有趣。但那是很難過及很大的沖激，孩子真的不習慣父母時時在家，你知喇，父母以前時時在餐館，很少在家，然後他們只見到家中沮喪的一面，他們不想留在家，這課後活動對他們來說很好。</p>
<p>問﹕他們有沒有，有沒有做一些直接和9/11有關的事情，如寫作或……﹖</p>

<p> 楊﹕有，他們寫很多有關事件，一位老師，帶他們到Nino餐館，Nino有很多消防員及拯救人員的食客，所以學生前去，寫作了一大份有關Nino餐館的記錄文獻，他們籌款，將支票帶給Nino餐館老闆，坐下來和他傾談，他們又訪問了消防員，警員，和英文老師寫下文獻，然後，在學校展示，他們錄影，到現在仍保留著，你知喇，老師仍然在，他們仍然保留這項目，孩子寫書。然後我們有訪客從奧克拉荷馬州來，講述他們遇到的災難，這些對話將學校、社區、及老師團結起來。<br>

然後我們明白，你知喇，我們做這些外展，嘗試確保孩子得到照顧，但我明白老師也需要這些照顧，於是我們嘗試用九萬元及其他款項的一部份，我們招聚老師在一起，做一些藝術治療，於是我們辦了些藝術治療，其實，我們仍然有自由計劃的款項，那是9/11的剩餘撥款，這是第二年撥款，這次辦的藝術治療已有兩年半歷史，我們的孩子仍然獲得撥款，直到年底，可能明年也有。很受老師歡迎，因為老師在午餐聚在一起，繪畫很美妙的圖畫，表達自己的感覺，也有瑜伽導師來教老師瑜伽，我們也有香薰治療。</p>
<p>有三次，人們來按摩，帶來了按摩枱，我們擺設美好的環境，暗燈、蠟燭、音樂，在老師在空堂時簽名，進來，在按摩枱接受按摩，真的很好，老師有不同鬆弛的方或，你知喇，老師也有退修機會，一些老師去了，於是我們明白成年人也需要，你知喇，有時比孩子更需要，因為老師承受的壓力也非常大。</p>
<p>問﹕是呀。</p>
<p>楊﹕是呀，照顧一千三百名孩子及百多名老師是一宗龐大工程。</p>
<p>問﹕是呀。</p>
<p>楊﹕你知喇。</p>
<p>問﹕有沒有方法，你如何知道，你覺得你能夠，知道孩子的心情如何嗎﹖</p>
<p>楊﹕是呀，嗯，你知喇，我們有輔導前來，我們有，但你知喇，可能是我的性格及我的處世態度，但我感覺，你知喇，是的，我們有少少傷心的時刻，但也要繼續生活，夠了，我們需要前進，我知道一些教職員多少認為我沒有做得足夠，也不夠憐憫，沒有很多記念，需要繼續評論，繼續記念，想我放更多時間，我知一些老師會這樣想，但我覺得只是，這是我，我是這樣想，我覺得應繼續向前。但有一些老師持相反意見，覺得好像你做得不足夠，你知喇，我們原本可以做得更多，又。但我，我的感覺是，該是前進的時候了。</p>
<p>[訪問完畢]</p>